Curse

Giga Strike · Nov 29, 2006, 05:05 PM // 17:05

I think of dervishes as close range AoE spikers so i will use them in my groups. as for using them, no. im not a good dervish user. my energy always runs out quickly and i cant seem to balance casting and attacking very well.

also, im astonished that ppl would compare dervishes to assassins. they arnt the same, not close. though they are both spikers the way you use them is completely different.

Guardian of the Light · Nov 30, 2006, 12:08 AM // 00:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Progor

The true power of a Dervish lies in its versatility.

No other class in the game boasts all of these in one package:

incredible damage
- the scythe is the highest damage weapon in the game AND AoE on every swing
- Heart of Fury is one of the best IAS's in the game, outclassed only by flail and frenzy when you can work around their drawbacks
incredible defense
- Armor of Sanctity is one of only 3 damage absorption skills in the game, and combines perfectly with veil of thorns to meet it's condition
- Conviction is one of the few defensive stances that can be kept up permanently
- Mystic Regeneration has replaced Troll Unguent as one of the premier self-heals in the game
- Mystic Vigor - W/Mo's have to invest 10 points in Healing Prayers and take 2 enchantments to match it's health per swing, and can't touch it if you hit multiple foes
- multiple attacks that have a side effect of healing you
- Vow of Silence is the only spell shield in the game that can be kept up constantly on its own
- Mirage Cloak - if your build can afford it, a constant 50% evade is a boon
- Windwalker's Armor - all defensive dervishes should have enough enchantments to keep this at it's 15 bonus armor rating.
- 4 pips of energy regen make all these defenses much easier to sustain
incredible utility
- dargon already covered it's condition spreading power.
- Mystic Healing is the best party heal in the game
- Pious Restoration provides the only self hex removal on a melee class
- Multiple enchantment removal skills
- Everything you need for running (Dervishes can even make the Droks run)
And they just look darn cool

Of course, you can't get all that functionality in one build, but the power of the Dervish lies in the fact that you can mix-n-match. If you want to fully capitalize on that high damage scythe, take relatively few enchantments, max out your Scythe Mastery, and take several attacks with you. You will be a lot like an assassin, but with a more constant damage output that doesn't rely on criticals and double hits to keep it's DPS up.

On the other hand, you can load up on the enchantments, cover them all with a Vow of Silence to stop most of the enchantment removal skills out there, and stand on the front lines and tank with the Dolyak Signet warriors (without the huge mobility hit). You might not have the points for more than 9 or so points for Scythe Mastery, but you'll be practically invulnerable.

But more than likely, you'll want to combine these two extremes take a few skills from the defensive side and a few from the offensive side and make a character that is about as tough as a warrior, but has better damage potential, especially when the targets line up. Then throw in a skill or two from your utility toolbox to help out your team, and you have one of the best all-around characters in the game.

For defense you can added the Vital Boon + Signet of Poius Light. One of the best self heals in the game.

fashion07 · Nov 30, 2006, 08:42 AM // 08:42

Dervish is pertty good ,if u know how to play well. man
other ppl who said Dervish is weak becasue they don't know about Dervish ^^ forgive them !

Priest Of Sin · Dec 01, 2006, 05:59 AM // 05:59

#1: assassins have some very good defensive skills (vipers def+heart of shadow, anyone?)

#2: Dervish, in the right hands, outdamages and outdefends a warrior.

#3: you can solo anything in NF (except perhaps teh Shiro mission) with heroes+henchies, ignore the morons.

Str0b0 · Dec 01, 2006, 05:54 PM // 17:54

I found that Dwayna makes for a hellacious tank, Well Dwayna or Melandru, unless you get fragility on you with the latter then it sucks. I rarely have to use the Avatar form though. When I do it is in hex heavy mobs and then all I have to do is throw on Dwayna, spam my scythe attacks and bam no more hexes and I get healed for 41 points of damage every time. I use Mirage Cloak, Vital boon, and Heart of fury plus Faithful intervention and I'm pretty much unstoppable. I maintain at least 3 enchants at all times so there is another 15 AL, plus the health swell from Vital boon, plus the 50% avoid from mirage and I rarely take significant damage. Dervishes are infinitely more survivable than Assassins. The only thing that is somewhat troublesome is managing your enchants and layering them properly. Once you get that down then you are golden. I haven't gotten Mystic regeneration yet but that's going in there too. I'm also thinking of building an ebon Dust build for the blinding. I've already got an Ebon snathe picked out for a new scythe.

Skuld · Dec 01, 2006, 05:58 PM // 17:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Priest Of Sin

#1: assassins have some very good defensive skills (vipers def+heart of shadow, anyone?)

#2: Dervish, in the right hands, outdamages and outdefends a warrior.

#3: you can solo anything in NF (except perhaps teh Shiro mission) with heroes+henchies, ignore the morons.

1) Feigned Neutraility and Dark Escape..

2) They are different classes, don't compare them.

3) 8 party member solo?

Family Draconis · Dec 01, 2006, 06:11 PM // 18:11

I definitely agree with you. I also am disgusted at the fact that people don't like Dervishes. I love my dervish and I have a build made specifically to keep up with the tanking power of any warrior, yet whenever I try to defend myself, no one wants to take the chance that I'm right. We need to start getting the word out there, just as with assassins in factions, that the Dervish can do the job as well. After all, the whole idea around making the dervishes was to have a second class that could keep up with warriors in both damage and tanking ability.

Not saying that assassins also can't do that job, but in reality, assassins by nature should be shadowed damage, or hit and run. They should be the first ones in, then meld back into the fray and attack from a flanking position, unlike a dervish or a warrior who should get in ASAP and just stay there. Anyway, I'm getting off topic. In conclusion, Dervish is a good tanking class when build right, just like any other class.

Stemnin · Dec 01, 2006, 06:11 PM // 18:11

This is why I used heroes and henchies for all of nightfall with my new dervish, I can't blame ppl, when I started going through NF with my monk, seen a few dervs in missions with me, they really really really sucked, I wouldve prefered to take ANY sin. I think they were the same peeps ive seen just using sever artery and saying thats not the only skill they have, but the only one they use. I prefer not to bring a dervish because of this.

I played only dervish during the preview events in RA trying out builds, with most of the skills unlocked, so going through NF was incredibly easy with hench.

Str0b0 · Dec 01, 2006, 07:07 PM // 19:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

1) Feigned Neutraility and Dark Escape..

2) They are different classes, don't compare them.

3) 8 party member solo?

Actually I think it is a perfectly valid and legitimate comparison to make. While they are indeed different classes the role is very very similar. Just look at the way the dervish is designed. All your attacks hit multiple foes, the survival and armor boosting skills. Dervishes are obviously meant to be front line damage dealers and tanks just the same as warriors. The only difference is the warrior accomplishes this through high AL the dervish uses enchants. That's the only significant difference. The methodology is different the task is the same.

Granted Dervishes have a sort of jack of all trades thing going on like rangers but I think at their core they are designed to be front line tanks with the ability to play different roles while still performing that function. For example the Dervish's ability to put multiple conditions on foes is unmatched by any other class but they still have to be up front, tanking the enemies they want to drop those conditions on. Warrior Dervish comparisons are going to happen and they are much more valid than making Dervish Assassin comparisons.

The Last Preacher · Dec 02, 2006, 10:59 AM // 10:59

I dissagree. Like assassins everyone had to make one in the new chapter. The majority of dervishes sucks. Not saying the profession sucks but the crowds of kids who fell for the scythes and hoods.

Feathers · Dec 03, 2006, 12:56 AM // 00:56

I would have to say after playing a Dervish myself that they can handle the job just as good as any warrior. Granted a warrior can absorb the damage better just due to their armor lvl but if a player has the correct set up and knows how to balance their enchantments then there is no reason a Dervish can not tank. I feel like a lot of you though in that many players simply do not yet know what they're doing with this class. It requires a little more thought then UGH ! the big warrior that smashes things. Once mine is set up I will probably delete my own warrior in favor of the Dervish. The versitility and damage out put of the class alone has the warrior beat hands down.

Dutch Masterr · Dec 03, 2006, 06:21 AM // 06:21

where do you all get off saying dervish is "better" than assassin and that assassin is "weak"

yes, assassin armor is basically paper....that doesnt matter.

assassins have speed and power..but in a different way that other classes. they are designed to kill a single target alone and effiently before their target even has time to react. in fact, ive never done mroe spike damage with any other class than assassin. one skill chain can single handedly kill a target. ive killed many dervish, including ones with avatar of melandru/balthazar with sins.

dervish are "simmilar" to mo/w. they have crap armor like assassin, but have many enchantments for offense and defense at the same time. they can throw out many conditions, and then gain benifits off of those conditions that are thrown out...something very unique. they can, if played right, be effective tanks...they can even replace warriors in a group, pve or pvp.

Rainman · Dec 03, 2006, 10:13 AM // 10:13

iv came up with a build to show that dervish can out defend warriors.

think of a dervish/assasin with avatar of balthazar conviction extend enchantments and feigned neutrality for defense skills 1 res sig 2 scythe attacks (lyssas assault seems good) 1 enchantment that never ends i forgot what its called (whenever you go under 50% health this spell ends and heals you for ___) the result 174 defense for up to 24 seconds

Skuld · Dec 03, 2006, 10:36 AM // 10:36

Fiegned Neutrality ends if you use a skill, or attack.

Darkpower Alchemist · Dec 03, 2006, 12:13 PM // 12:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch Masterr

where do you all get off saying dervish is "better" than assassin and that assassin is "weak"

yes, assassin armor is basically paper....that doesnt matter.

assassins have speed and power..but in a different way that other classes. they are designed to kill a single target alone and effiently before their target even has time to react. in fact, ive never done mroe spike damage with any other class than assassin. one skill chain can single handedly kill a target. ive killed many dervish, including ones with avatar of melandru/balthazar with sins.

If you, with your sin, kill a Dervish using Avatar of Balthazar, then he was a poor Dervish to start.I like the sin's ability, but The Avatars can truely outpower and overpower any sin build you can think of. I tanked through warriors and sins with my Dervish, not saying that they don't need some effort to get the job done against a warrior, but the sin is truely outmatched in a blow for blow. Now,2 sins...that may end differently.

BTW, don't sins and dervish have the same base max armor rating?

Extreme Measures · Dec 03, 2006, 05:37 PM // 17:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainman

ok when i 1st got nightfall i made a dervish but whenever i wanted a party for a mission no1 wanted me. today i asked every1 why the hates dervish'. they all replied with they are weak and defensless like assasins. i was shocked that some people would think that!

for 1 thing assasins are strong and defenseful but saying dervish are like assasin??? the only think in common is the armour defense (70 AL).
dervish have loads of skills to do amazing damage and protect themselves. i could go right now stick a few skills together and it would turn out a good build. the problem with guild wars is that it is inhabited by idiots that think because we have 10 AL less than warriors we cant tqank or take damage at all! they treat dervish' like they are casters! i am very tired of them saying this and not letting me into a party JUST BECAUSE IM A DERVISH. i mean you have got to agree that dervish are not being treated as well as they should.

it seems that almost everyone hates them! the worse part is that the nf missions are hard to do with heroes. well anyway this is my thread about people treating dervish wrong.

thanks

You said: the worse part is that the nf missions are hard to do with heroes.

Im a mesmer, and I could care less about the prima donna jerkoffs in the game today. I have beat the entire game using only heros, +hench... and beating abbadon at the end with heros was about the easiest mission in the game.
You are right however, the game is full of people whom are full of themselves, and I dont even bother trying to get into groups anymore, but you might try something if you are interested in playing with a live party. Make your own group. There are always people in the zone LFGing for a mission run. Just make your own group, and you will be on your way.
Hope this helps.

Tingi · Dec 03, 2006, 06:32 PM // 18:32

Dervishes are so awsome. One of my favourite profs so far i think. Their defensive skills are brilliant in PvE with skills such as vital boon + mystic regenration and conviction. And some really nice attack skills and IAS skill. I think Anet did a very good job thinking over the Dervish prof.

Dzus · Dec 03, 2006, 06:47 PM // 18:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

If you've found you can't tank with a dervish than you have no idea how to play them.

If you find you can't do much of anything with a Dervish, you're obviously playing the wrong class.

Though, I never really bothered tanking. I have my warriors for that. I rolled a Dervish so I wouldn't be expected to tank and still have a melee class.

I love the versitility of this class, it's not quite a Swiss Army knife, but it is a clever balance of casting and hard-hitting melee.

drupal · Dec 03, 2006, 09:06 PM // 21:06

Dervish tanks work actually pretty well, their weakness are mesmers or necros

jesh · Dec 04, 2006, 09:02 AM // 09:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkpower Alchemist

If you, with your sin, kill a Dervish using Avatar of Balthazar, then he was a poor Dervish to start.I like the sin's ability, but The Avatars can truely outpower and overpower any sin build you can think of. I tanked through warriors and sins with my Dervish, not saying that they don't need some effort to get the job done against a warrior, but the sin is truely outmatched in a blow for blow. Now,2 sins...that may end differently.

BTW, don't sins and dervish have the same base max armor rating?

A *spike* from a dervish will always be slower due to attack speed differences. Dervishes have nowhere close the mobility of the assassin class, and that is why assassins still have their role. If there is any role that the dervish class encroaches on, I feel it is the warrior, not the assassin.

Quote:

Originally Posted by drupal

Dervish tanks work actually pretty well, their weakness are mesmers or necros

Uh.. I think the same goes for pretty much any melee class, unless you have a build especially designed to counter this type of hate. After all, this is what the necro curses line and mesmer skills were made to do.

My feelings on the Dervish class.. *sigh*
Honestly, I think that an average player can do much better on a dervish than a warrior. Coupled with the self heals that are so rampant in the class, and you have every person with little to no skill flocking to them. Not to mention the scythes and hoods. You can argue with me, but every day I see more people that think they are real badasses because they can do 20ish damage and tank your entire team. Why this class isn't as hated as the paladin preset of old, I still have no clue.